Chen Xi — Facing the Beast: The Mission of the Opposition
采访/编辑：赵杰 时间： 2025/8/16
陈西先生介绍：基督徒，资深异议人士。1980年代以来，先后参与组织「沙龙联谊会」、「爱国民主联合会」、「中国民主党贵州分部」及「公民国际人权研讨会」，是贵州民主人权运动核心人物之一。发表有一百七十多篇政论文章，著有五十万字的《绿色文化工具书》。曾三次被捕入狱，一共在狱中服刑二十三年。
赵杰：陈西前辈您好，您当初是在体制内工作的人，后来却走上了一条完全不同的路。您还记得那时候是因为什么让您有了转变？
陈西先生：是因为一九八九年发生的六四事件，我认为是民主社会选择了我，当时我在当地的一个大学，当时拍板定我有罪的公安局长他找我谈话，他说我很有代表性，这个代表性不是随便一个人能够代替的，他们选中我作为一九八九年六四事件贵州地区这个代表是因为我是共产党员，国家干部，大学老师，也曾经当过兵，也做过工人，那么他这样子跟我说的话我也认了，因为毕竟我在社会上也做了关于讨论民主的工作 ，我跟朱虞夫先生说过我在部队的时候是一个文艺兵 ，也就是吹、拉、弹、唱我都可以的都没问题的 ，那么在八九年以前呢 ，我在贵阳和朋友们曾经搞了一个【沙龙联谊会】，当时我很单纯的认为社会年轻人 8小时以外的时间，是非常宝贵的。而我本人有这个能力，当兵的人都有组织能力，所以和朋友一起在贵阳举办了「浪潮讀書會」、「英語角」等民間沙龍活動，1989年，民主運動期間，我举办【沙龙联谊会】也在当地参加声援了那场学运 ，但是当时公安机关没有立刻处罚我，是后来当地公安机关跟我说：全国这么大的运动，贵州总得有代表吧，我当时想既然国家，民族是这样认定我做贵州的这个代表，那么我当时就只能承认死了， 我就是那个贵州的代表，过去我只是被动的参与建设民主社会，那么以后呢我就认为我应当主动的投入民主社会生活当中去，这是我作为民主人士的一个起点，我在我以前在网络上发表的文章中写到，我也欢迎大家前去上网看一下，是六四事件改变我，也是六四事件改变我们很多人，这是我的回答。
赵杰：确实，八九年的六四事件确实改变很多人的命运，今天我和朱虞夫先生还参加在洛杉矶六四纪念馆举办的陈小平先生关于反思六四事件的专题讲座，在那里也看到更多像您一样被六四改变了人生轨迹的人，他们和您一样都有这一颗追求自由，向往民主的心，虽然您是被中共强迫的拉上这样一条路，但是您毅然决然的走上了这条路，是非常值得人敬佩的。
赵杰：我们知道您是三次被捕入狱，那您在监狱中是否遭受到很多折磨 ？虽然我自己没有被正式判刑入狱过，但我自己也曾经因为组织村民一起反抗政府非法暴力拆迁中说了一些关于这个政权就是个土匪、流氓之类的话，就被派出所拘留过，我深知当一个人去面对这种国家的机器的时候肯定内心都有一些恐惧和不安吧 ，那像您是怎么样坚持的 ？而且就是哪怕自己后来出狱依然继续坚持这条路，又因坚持这条路又反复入狱，直到现在来看，您依然继续在坚持这条路？
陈西先生：这个问题我是这么想的，我跟我的太太也说过，尽管你们不太读书对法律方面的知识各方面都不太清楚，但是人要凭着良心凭着良知去做事情，那么的话就可以义无反顾，也就是老百姓所说的身正不怕影子斜，那么我前前后后入狱时，我就在想：我又没做错了什么，我认为我没有做错什么，我认为呢，我是把我的精力、把我的时间和生命以及整个国家，民族它的前途，我是在潜意识中把它考虑进去了，所以我组织参加社会上的一些追求民主的义工活动，这是在八九学潮前我就已经开始做的事情，以前我做这种事情是短暂的，现在我被捕入狱了就当上了个大学，我现在想全身心投入社会、国家、民主、未来的这个事业当中去，那么我就思考整个国家它缺少什么，不缺什么，就像一个人他吃饱饭后物质得到满足，但在追求精神世界的自由是缺乏的，当时我就认为我们当下的国家，在民主方面的发展几千年来它都是缺乏的，这方面我就不太细讲了，大家有兴趣可以去网上观看我写的文章，但是我们最终的理想就是要丰满整个社会文化、民主、自由、平等，这些多元化的理念要深入到更多人的观念中去，打造平衡的社会关系。
赵杰：我在来美国后在读过王炳章先生写的一部叫《民运手册》，书中的第一章就是说这个人类刚开始没有政权，没有政府这个概念的。人类就是为了在以前那个恶劣的自然环境生存活下去，才相互抱团取暖，慢慢随着人类文明的发展，才有了政权和政府这个概念，但后来这个本应该为大家遮挡苦难的地方最后确成了最大的苦难的来源，这样的政权还有存在的必要吗？我们是不是应该推翻它呢？
陈西先生：是的，就是这个政权它存在的意义本身就不是为少数人服务的，这个当权者处在这个位置上，他们有他们的焦虑，在一些问题处理出现了很极端的情况，但是我个人认为呢，我们尽量去要理性的处理和解决这些事情，我们普通百姓总是有英雄情结，总希望有个英雄能带领我们推翻当时的政权，但从历史的经验教训来看，大多数的英雄带给普通民众的又是一场灾难，这也是为什么几千年的中国历史就是一场保皇位与打皇位之间的争斗，我个人觉得应该给政府划出一个边界，一个界限，举个例子我总是把自己当成一个驯兽师，这个政权就是一头野兽，我们要去驯化它，在驯化它的过程中肯定会受伤，甚至于付出生命的代价，但驯化本身就是一个漫长的过程，但总比屠杀掉这只野兽又出现了另一只野兽。这个如何打造一个文明的社会的问题，其实英国已经给了我们答案，著名的英国的《大宪章》就是由英国的骑士们以及各个阶层的人们一起起草，他们反抗国王并不是要把国王杀掉，并且经过各种斗争打败国王，最后让国王在大宪章上面签字，这本身就是一种驯服权利这头野兽的过程。
赵杰：谢谢陈西先生的回答，你这个回答也阐述你对如何解决屠龙者终成恶龙的问题，这个也对于我们未来如何打破中国陷入历史的轮回给出了建议。陈西老师我在添加您的微信时候看到你的微信名字叫：陈西.反者.公民。这个您起的微信名字对于您个人来说是想表达什么样的想法呢？
陈西先生：首先陈西是我的名字，反者想表达的意思是我要做一个反者，一个文明的社会不应该只有正的一方，它应该有一个或者一群反者，中国目前的社会最大的问题就是不允许反对派的存在，对于敢于做出头鸟的人就是狠狠的打压，但我个人来讲有一句话叫：世上若无出头鸟，世人皆是待宰鸡，我愿意为世人做这一只出头鸟，最后的公民就是表达：我想做一个公民，而不是一个居民，行使一个公民的权益，监督甚至批评政府的一些行为，虽然付出是巨大的，但也赢得很多的尊敬，包括你们海外的人士的支持，十分感激。
赵杰：是的，作为一个坚定的反对派，前后二十多年的牢狱生活，对您和您的家庭来说付出的代价不可为不巨大，您这些年都是被定义为政治犯关进监狱的，政治犯在监狱服刑期间有没有在身体和精神上遭到当局的恶意伤害呢？
陈西先生：是的，通常政治犯是因为颠覆国家政权罪入狱服刑，而中国的司法系统以及监狱系统又是在中共的绝对掌权下控制的，他们对待我是有多次身体和精神上伤害的，记得有一次好几个人把我围起来打，企图让我屈服，我不屈服只是一味的大声喊叫，至今还有一个很深的伤疤留在我的左眼眉毛下面，后来出狱后我太太帮我剃头，发现我的头上都是一些凹点，这些都是在监狱被打后留下来的，而且监狱里的房间通常会把本身只能容纳八个人的房间安排住进十几个人住进去，默许监狱中欺压其他犯人的狱霸的存在，把监狱中的日用品用远高于市场价出售，甚至在生病期间把本应该服用药物的剂量减去三分之二，他们根本就不在乎人的生命，这种事情在我多个服刑的监狱都遇到过，我也相信在国内大部分的监狱都存在这样的情况。
赵杰： 那你曾经在监狱中还有其他场合受到当局残酷打压以及酷刑的时候是否有机会或者有这样的规章制度允许您向外界，向其他部门控诉您的遭遇呢？
陈西前辈左眼被当局殴打留下伤疤
陈西先生：有这样的想法，也这样去行动过，我们在举办贵州人权研讨会期间，以及一些敏感时期时候，（敏感时期：例如当局召开两会，或者当地举办国际性会议和赛事时期）我们被国安和警察强制要求驱散甚至于限制人身自由，我们只要稍微不服从，就遭到国安，警察们的毒打，我们也使用法律也捍卫自己权益，因此我们向贵州市中级人民法院投诉贵州省公安局以及其局长、法人代表。那么我们把这个投诉交到中级人民法院，中级法院通知一个星期给我们结果，等待一个星期后，他们又那个投诉又退还给我，并告诉我投诉不了，中国在司法不独立是不可能投诉的，所有的机关，部门都是必须在党的领导下，法律应该是人人遵守的规则，不应该成为一种工具，我在我的有些文章里提过这些问题，这也是未来我们必须解决的问题。
赵杰：陈前辈，您现在是《在野党》杂志的荣誉主编，您的照片和姓名将一直挂在网上，您的实名文章《“文明对话国际日“公告》系列也是发表在《在野党》杂志上，您现在是什么心情？您不怕再次因此而坐牢吗？
陈西先生：小赵，《在野党》成立之初，当局就找到过我，但我没有畏惧，我认为人人生而平等，我们有免于恐惧的权利，无惧则无畏，这也是我为什么能坚持下去的信念。
赵杰：在野党这本刊物1998年在中国已经编写过十一期了，现在我们在海外复刊，网站已经更新了十二期和十三期，纸质版的也印刷出来了，这一次对您的采访也是我们第十四期《在野党》人物专访栏目内容，您是荣誉主编，您对它有什么期待？
陈西先生：《在野党》这个党刊非常好，非常好，我们中华民族太需要这种杂志，我之前说过反者，在野党的存在就是一种反对派，目前的中国需要有其他声音的存在，你们做的非常好，你们做了当做的事情，宝贵的事情，希望你们年轻的党员继续坚持下去，让后世子孙记住这段应该被记录的历史。
杰 赵, [2025/8/16 10:32]
赵杰：谢谢陈西前辈，谢谢您对我们的鼓励，复刊《在野党》是朱老最大的心愿，这么多年海外民运和国内民运之间的联系太少了，对于国内民运前辈的遭遇和现状也了解的太少了，《在野党》的复刊就是为了改变这一局面，让更多的海内外华人都了解这段建立中国反对派的历史经历，也了解你们这些前辈为此付出的代价和坚定的信仰，为此我们也成立专门的对外联络部，希望以后能随时联系您，让您感受到您是有后盾支持的，感谢，感谢您为中华民族所做的一切。
责任编辑：鲁慧文 翻译：鲁慧文
Chen Xi — Facing the Beast: The Mission of the Opposition
Interview/Editing: Zhao Jie. Date: August 16, 2025
Introduction of Mr. Chen Xi: A Christian and veteran dissident. Since the 1980s, he has successively participated in organizing the “Salon Fellowship,” the “Patriotic Democracy Union,” the “Guizhou Branch of the China Democracy Party,” and the “International Symposium on Human Rights by Citizens.” He is one of the core figures of the human rights and democracy movement in Guizhou. He has published more than 170 political essays and authored the 500,000-character Green Culture Handbook. He has been imprisoned three times, serving a total of twenty-three years in prison.
Zhao Jie: Senior Chen Xi, hello. You once worked within the system, but later you embarked on a completely different path. Do you still remember what made you change back then?
Mr. Chen Xi: It was because of the June Fourth Incident in 1989. I believe it was democracy that chose me. At the time, I was at a local university. The Public Security Bureau chief, who decided I was guilty, spoke to me. He said I was very representative — not just anyone could replace me. They selected me as the representative of the June Fourth Incident in Guizhou because I was a Communist Party member, a state cadre, a university teacher, a former soldier, and a worker. When he said this, I accepted it, because after all, I had already been involved in discussions about democracy. I once told Mr. Zhu Yufu that when I was in the army, I served as a literary soldier — I could sing, play instruments, and perform. Before 1989, in Guiyang, I had organized the “Salon Fellowship” with friends. At that time, I simply believed that young people’s time outside of their 8-hour work was very precious. And since I had this ability — as soldiers have organizational skills — I held folk salon activities in Guiyang with friends, such as the “Wave Reading Club” and “English Corner.” In 1989, during the democracy movement, I organized the Salon Fellowship and participated in supporting the student movement locally. But at the time, the public security authorities did not immediately punish me. Later, they told me: “This is such a nationwide movement, Guizhou must also have a representative.” I thought, since the state and the nation have already designated me as this representative from Guizhou, then I could only acknowledge it, even if it meant death — I would be that representative. In the past, I was passively involved in building a democratic society. From then on, I believed I should actively devote myself to democratic life. That was my starting point as a democrat. I have written this in my online articles before — I also welcome everyone to look them up. It was June Fourth that changed me, and it was June Fourth that changed many others. That is my answer.
Zhao Jie: Indeed, the June Fourth Incident changed the destinies of many people. Today, Mr. Zhu Yufu and I also attended Mr. Chen Xiaoping’s special lecture reflecting on June Fourth at the June Fourth Memorial Museum in Los Angeles. There we also saw many others whose life paths were altered by June Fourth. Like you, they share the same pursuit of freedom and longing for democracy. Although you were forced onto this path by the CCP, the fact that you resolutely walked it is truly admirable.
Zhao Jie: We know you have been imprisoned three times. Did you suffer a lot of torment in prison? Although I myself have never been formally sentenced, I was once detained by the police station for organizing villagers to resist illegal violent demolition by the government. I said that this regime is nothing but bandits and thugs. I deeply understand that when an individual faces the state machine, there must be fear and unease. How did you manage to persevere? And even after your release, you still insisted on this path, which led to repeated imprisonments. Now, looking back, you are still persisting.
Mr. Chen Xi: This is how I see it. I have also said this to my wife: even if you don’t read much or know little about law, a person must act according to conscience and moral sense. Then one can go forward without hesitation. As ordinary people say: “If you are upright, you need not fear your shadow being crooked.” Each time I was imprisoned, I thought: I did nothing wrong. I truly believe I did nothing wrong. I believed that I had, in my subconscious, factored into my actions the fate of my country, my nation, its future. That’s why I devoted my energy, my time, my life to organizing and participating in voluntary activities for democracy. This is something I had already been doing even before June Fourth. Before, it was temporary; after imprisonment, I treated it as a university, and now I want to devote myself entirely to the cause of society, the country, democracy, and the future. So I reflected: what is the country lacking, what is it not lacking? Just as when a person is well-fed but still lacks spiritual freedom, I believed then that our country had been lacking in democratic development for thousands of years. I won’t go into too much detail here. Those interested can read my articles online. But ultimately, our ideal is to enrich society with culture, democracy, freedom, equality — these pluralistic concepts must enter into more people’s minds to build balanced social relations.
Zhao Jie: After coming to the U.S., I read Dr. Wang Bingzhang’s book Manual of the Democracy Movement. Its first chapter states that at the beginning, humanity had no concept of government or political power. Humans banded together just to survive the harsh natural environment. Later, with the development of civilization, came the idea of government. But what should have shielded people from suffering instead became the greatest source of suffering. Does such a regime still need to exist? Should we overthrow it?
Mr. Chen Xi: Yes. The existence of a regime is not meant to serve a minority. Those in power have their anxieties. Sometimes their handling of issues becomes extreme. But I personally believe we should try to handle these issues rationally. Ordinary people often have a hero complex — they hope a hero will lead them to overthrow the regime. But from history’s lessons, most heroes have brought new disasters to the people. This is why thousands of years of Chinese history has been nothing more than a struggle between defending the throne and seizing the throne. I believe we should draw boundaries for government. For example, I often see myself as a beast tamer, and the regime as a wild beast. We must tame it. In the process of taming, we may be injured, even lose our lives, but taming is a long process. It is still better than slaughtering the beast and simply replacing it with another beast. As for how to build a civilized society, Britain has already given us the answer. The famous Magna Carta was drafted by knights and people from all classes. They did not want to kill the king; rather, through struggle, they defeated him and forced him to sign it. This itself was the process of taming the beast of power.
Zhao Jie: Thank you, Mr. Chen Xi. Your answer also addresses the question of “the dragon-slayer becoming the dragon,” and offers us a way to avoid repeating China’s historical cycle. Mr. Chen, when I added your WeChat, I noticed your username is: Chen Xi. Opposer. Citizen. What personal meaning does this name carry for you?
Mr. Chen Xi: First, Chen Xi is my name. Opposer expresses my wish to be an opposer. A civilized society should not have only the “positive” side; it must also allow the existence of opposition. China’s biggest problem now is that opposition is not allowed. Those who dare to stand out are harshly suppressed. Personally, I often say: if there are no birds that dare to stand out, then everyone is just a chicken waiting to be slaughtered. I am willing to be that bird. As for Citizen, it is to express my wish to be a citizen, not just a resident — to exercise a citizen’s rights, to supervise and even criticize the government’s actions. Although the price is enormous, it has also earned respect, including from friends overseas. I am very grateful.
Zhao Jie: Indeed, as a firm member of the opposition, more than twenty years of prison life has been an enormous price paid by you and your family. You have been imprisoned as a political prisoner. During your time in prison, did you suffer deliberate harm to your body and mind at the hands of the authorities?
Mr. Chen Xi: Yes. Political prisoners are usually convicted of “subverting state power.” And China’s judicial and prison systems are absolutely controlled by the CCP. They inflicted both physical and psychological harm on me many times. I remember once, several people surrounded me and beat me, trying to force me to submit. I refused, only shouting loudly. To this day, I still carry a deep scar below my left eyebrow. After I was released, my wife cut my hair and found that my head was full of dents — scars left from beatings in prison. Moreover, cells that should hold eight people were often stuffed with more than a dozen, and prison authorities tolerated the existence of prison bullies. Daily necessities were sold at prices far above the market. Even when sick, the prescribed dosage of medicine would be reduced by two-thirds. They simply did not care about human life. I experienced this in multiple prisons where I served time. I also believe this is the situation in most prisons in China.
Zhao Jie: When you suffered such brutal suppression and torture in prison or elsewhere, was there any chance, or any regulations, allowing you to file complaints to outside authorities?
(Photo Caption: Scar left on Mr. Chen Xi’s left eye from being beaten by authorities)
Mr. Chen Xi: I had such thoughts and did take such actions. During the period when we organized the Guizhou Human Rights Symposium, and during certain sensitive times (for example: when the authorities held the “Two Sessions” or hosted international conferences and events), we were forcibly dispersed and even had our freedom restricted by state security and police. If we resisted even slightly, we were beaten. We also tried to defend our rights using law. We once filed a complaint with the Guiyang Intermediate People’s Court against the Guizhou Provincial Public Security Bureau and its director, the legal representative. The court told us it would give a result in one week. After waiting a week, they returned the complaint, saying it could not be accepted. In a system without judicial independence, it is impossible to file complaints. All agencies and departments must obey the Party’s leadership. Law should be rules that everyone abides by, not a tool. I have raised these issues in some of my articles, and this is also something that must be solved in the future.
Zhao Jie: Senior Chen, you are now the Honorary Chief Editor of The Opposition Party. Your photo and name will remain published online, and your signed articles — such as the “International Day of Civilized Dialogue” Proclamation series — have also been published in The Opposition Party. What is your current feeling? Are you not afraid of being imprisoned again because of this?
Mr. Chen Xi: Xiao Zhao, when The Opposition Party was first established, the authorities came to me, but I was not afraid. I believe all people are born equal, and we have the right to be free from fear. Without fear, there is no dread — this is the conviction that has enabled me to persevere.
Zhao Jie: The Opposition Party had already published eleven issues in China since 1998. Now we have relaunched it overseas. Issues 12 and 13 have already been updated online, and the printed editions have also been released. This interview with you is also part of the “Influencers Interviews” column in issue 14 of The Opposition Party. You are our Honorary Chief Editor. What expectations do you have for it?
Mr. Chen Xi: The Opposition Party as a party publication is excellent, truly excellent. Our Chinese nation is in great need of such a magazine. I have said before: an “opposer.” The existence of The Opposition Party itself means there is an opposition force. China today needs alternative voices. What you are doing is very good — you are doing what must be done, something truly precious. I hope that you young party members will continue to persevere, so that future generations will remember this piece of history that deserves to be recorded.
Zhao Jie: Thank you, Senior Chen Xi. Thank you for your encouragement. Relaunching The Opposition Party has been Elder Zhu’s greatest wish. For so many years, the connections between the overseas democracy movement and the domestic democracy movement have been far too few. People also know far too little about the experiences and current conditions of the older generation of democracy activists. The revival of The Opposition Party is meant to change this situation — so that more Chinese people, both at home and abroad, can understand this history of building a political opposition in China, as well as the price you seniors paid and the steadfast faith you upheld. For this reason, we have also established a dedicated External Liaison Department, so that we may always be in touch with you, and ensure that you feel you have a strong backing of support. Thank you, thank you for everything you have done for the Chinese nation.
Editor-in-Chief: Huiwen Lu
Translation: Huiwen Lu
